A Request for Opinions

[Nate the Great]

Okay, so I have neither a Gamecube nor a Revolution. Since I am still a geeky gamer fanboy, I'm gonna have to buy one or the other eventually. So this is a request for opinions. Refurbished Gamecube or New Revolution? As of right now, the only "killer app" I know of for Revolution is the upcoming Smash Brothers Brawl. Please keep the following in mind:

My disposable income isn't as bad as it was in college, but it's still pretty small.
It would go in my room, my TV is only about fourteen inches, and there's only about eight feet open in front of it.
I prefer left-handed Link, and all of the video game review sites I see are still giving GC TP a higher rating than Rev TP.
I would enjoy using a Gameboy Player. Go Mario Advance 4!

[PointyHairedJedi]

I wanted to buy a PS3, but apparently Sony do hate me after all.

Why not a Wii, Infinite?

[Nate the Great]

Reasons why I don't think buying a Revolution is a good idea:

1. The name "Wii" is absolutely atrocious.
2. I'd rather not break any TV screens, windows, or Wiimotes, thank you very much.
3. They refused to add DVD capability, charge fifty bucks more, and sell umpteen million more systems.
4. They didn't build in rechargable batteries into the Wiimote. Come on, what sort of idiot thought up that idea?
5. My TV is only thirteen inches (I measured this time), so I have neither the floorspace nor the display capabilities to fully take advantage of a Revolution.
6. Right-handed Links are just wrong!
7. The Virtual Console is too big of a temptation.

[AKAArzosah]

I like my Playstation 2, personally. All the 'new, improved, you-beaut' consoles are way more expensive that they're worth, IMO.

Playstation two plays DVDs, and also plays all the original first generation games (Gamecube can't say that, now can it!).

But not really being a geeky fangirl gamer myself, I guess I really can't advise.

[MaverickZer0]

Wii would like to play.

The instant I heard that slogan I forgave them the name. But you're right, Nate. Who would want to buy a console with Metroid Prime: Echoes, the new Zelda game, the new SSB game in the works, and all the new little goodies and stuff like the Wii weather channel. I mean, <i>it has a funny name</i>. Sheesh. And the remote!

...I still don't like the remote, but I've heard you can get controller-shaped attachments for it. After all, it was designed for FPS games, and I'm not into those. I'm a true nerd, not a casual gamer!

But, if Wii don't want to play (I love that so much now. The puns are limitless.) then get a Gamecube. It has SSBM and...uh...Mega Man Anniversary Collection. And some other things that I like but would be even out of my nerd range to mention. Not to mention that it's cheaper.

[Zeke]

One more vote for Wii. There's little point in buying a GameCube now, except maybe cost.

[Nate the Great]

Hey, the cost is a very valid reason by itself! For the $250 I would pay for the Revolution and one game, I could get a used Gamecube and at least six used games. Really.

[ijdgaf]

I own both. Get a Wii.

1) Not buying a console because of it's name is infinitely sillier than the name in the first place.
2) Use a damn wrist strap with the wiimote. It isn't hard. It becomes second nature, like putting on a seatbelt. You're a moron if you don't play with the straps.
3) Neither the gamecube nor the wii has DVD capability, don't you have anything else that plays DVDs? And yeah, initial price estimates for the Wii were $200. Those estimates neglected to predict a pack-in game. It's still tremendous value.
4) Rechargeable batteries/battery chargers are cheap these days. Also, you can buy 3rd party charging stations.
5) I've used the Wii on smaller TVs than that. It won't hamper you a bit.
6) The vast majority of Zelda has forgiven right-handed Link (or didn't care in the first place) -- give it up.
7) The virtual console is a wonderful resource. A great way to get classic games with minimal effort and minimal cash.

I'm all for buying old school systems, but not when newer, better systems do everything the older one does. There's no reason to buy a gamecube now unless you're a bumpkin and are looking to get into games for the first time at a reasonable price. Anybody with any real interest in newer titles should get a current-gen system. And anybody with any real brain would get either a Wii or a 360 between the current-gen systems.

Save up and get a Wii. Think of it as an investment toward the next 5 years of console gaming.

OR

If price is really that much of an object, get a DS. Thirty bucks more than a gamecube, and it's the most popular system on the planet right now. Titles are in over-abundance, and Nintendo's just getting started with it. Amazing system. You wouldn't regret it.

[Nate the Great]

Be glad I've edited the following from it's original version:

1. It's my right to stand by my decision, even if I admit that it's stupid.
2. The straps are perfectly fine, if you have the proper self-control all the time. Not everyone does. All it takes is forgetting to put it on once to smash something.
3. For a second, assume that you can only own one gaming console. Further assume that you have limited space in your entertainment center. Every extra function counts. Besides, I don't hear anyone complaining about the DVD capabilities of the PS3 or X-Box 360, do you? No one's saying "I don't want Blu-Ray in my PS3," are they? Even if it's technically "unnecessary," DVD players are available in the competition, so they should've been in Revolution just to keep up.
4. The existence of third-party accessories was never the point. The point is that if Nintendo doesn't care about basic things like charging their ubercontroller, why should I care about how nifty it is? And it is nifty, but not "spend five bucks on batteries a day" nifty.
5. Again, it wasn't only the TV size, it was the size of my available floorspace. Revolutions require MOVEMENT, right? The ability to make a full sword-swinging motion without knocking over a lamp or something?
6. Don't I have the right to have a preference or be comitted to a seemingly pointless opinion?
7. Apparently someone's Babel Fish is on the fritz. I said that VC is "too big of a temptation." That's it, no more.

[ijdgaf]

You really don't need to take an offended tone here, I wasn't aiming any of my condescending tone to you. But regardless, a few rebuttels that aren't really number synced with yours as before.

1) Really, this whole breaking-expensive-appliances-with-flying-wiimotes thing has been overplayed and exaggerated to no end. It's not a realistic concern. As I said, using the strap becomes second nature, just like wearing a seatbelt, for all but the most mundane of tasks -- for example, creating miis. And if you're really that aggressive when creating a mii....

2) Nintendo built a system that, brand new, costs 150 bucks less than the competition. In order to do that, it makes sense that they had to cut a few costs here and there. So I'm not too concerned that it doesn't play DVDs or charge my wiimotes. There are two additional points I'll make about DVD playback. First, assuming this will be your first sixth or seventh gen console (Gamecubes/X-Box/PS2 are sixth gen, Wii/360/PS3 are seventh), none of your old systems play DVDs either. It's not like you're losing functionality. Second, everything I've heard leads me to believe that using a console as your default DVD/UMD/Blu-Ray/Whatever player is a bad idea. It taxes the laser unnecessarily, and limits the lifespan of your system. You're better off using a dedicated DVD player that you'll be using only to watch movies, and perhaps to play music.

3) You really don't need that much space to move around in to use the Wii. That's not really too big a concern for me, as my TV is about 2 feet from the bed I sit on to play games. You don't really need to use exaggerated motions with the systems, and I've never encountered any problems here.

4) I simply expressed my thoughts on VC. I understood what you were trying to say, I was merely giving my input... is that a problem?

You titled the thread "A Request for Opinions." Nobody is saying you don't have the right to having your own views on silly/pointless/profound matters. But when you solicit the opinions from others on a public forum, you're... uh... bound to get a few? That might not mesh with yours? Hmm....

[Nate the Great]

Uh, yeah. Moving on to a lighter topic...

It sort of comes down to what you want versus what you need. For example, you may only NEED to move a Wiimote a few inches back and forth for a full sword motion, but what do you WANT? You want to jump around like the guy on the commercial, right?

[ijdgaf]

Well I don't mean to say you should get a Wii, but only if you're going to make slight movements. Unless you live in a broom closet, I'm sure you'll have more than enough room to move around comfortably. As long as you're not playing like Chris Farley as the van-by-the-river motivational speaker on that one SNL skit.

[Nate the Great]

Apparently people aren't grasping the concept of "this isn't a perfect world, people will go too far if they get sucked into a game enough to neglect common sense."

[ijdgaf]

People? You mean me.

I've played the system. I own it and use it regularly. I have many friends who do the same. Just because you see a small sample size of crazy-ass injuries/property damages which is exaggerated by the amazing prowess of the internet, does not mean this is the norm. The people on wiihaveaproblem are insane. And a small minority.

Of course, if you're intent on convincing yourself not to get a Wii, then by all means buy something else. Just don't use this "high probability of damages to self and/or objects" as an excuse. It's bogus.

[Nate the Great]

Never said "high probability." I said "probability." It IS there. If you mess up with any other wireless controller you aren't going to be flinging it into a TV or window, you'll just be dropping it on the floor. That's replacing a controller, not a TV or window.

I've found that plenty of "unlikely" events can happen much more often than people think.

Have you never been totally sucked into a TV or video game so far that you have no idea where you are or who you're with, and all independent thought has stopped?

[AKAArzosah]

Oh yeah... normally when I play video games, any question aimed at me has about a thirty second delay. Fortunately for me, I'm not one of those people who swings the controller around. I occasionally punch it in frustration, though, leading to all sorts of difficulties when needing an analog stick...

[ijdgaf]

Number of incidents posted on wiihaveaproblem (http://wiihaveaproblem.com/damage.php): 214

Number of wiis sold worldwide (http://www.vgcharts.org/ngwars.phpsource 2): 6.03 million

Chances of wiimote related catastrophe (estimated): 1 in 27,000.

According to this site (http://www.nhm.org/research/fishes/sharksff/sharkimg/sff38.html), those odds are slightly greater than dying in a bicycle accident, and slightly lower than dying in while playing soccer (football..?) in Britain.

Also, do keep in mind that a lot of the recorded incidents occured before Nintendo beefed up the straps. The newer ones have a much lower chance of being broken.

[Chancellor Valium]

What kind of bicycle?

Ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam.

[Nate the Great]

I'm gonna return to an earlier arguement. Can anyone explain to me why they apparently never pulled in people from the outside to test the system under real-world conditions to find out these things?

[ijdgaf]

They must've to some extent. Every damn Wii game comes with a plea to, for the love of Nintendo, USE THE DAMN STRAP (yeah, it's about that blunt).

But yeah. Working at a children's museum, you can try to test new exhibits and such as best you can to see how they'll hold up. But it's really damn tricky to out-crazy the crazies. Particularly when they're children.

[Nate the Great]

So these flimsy straps never broke once during the testing? Unlikely.

[AKAArzosah]

Maybe they thought it was a good way to get even more money - break the remote, so you have to buy a new one.

[Nate the Great]

Uh, the liability lawsuits about windows and TVs would prevent that sort of thing I HOPE.

[ijdgaf]

From Fight Club (the movie -- I don't remember this from the book, but I could be wrong):

"A new car built by my company leaves somewhere traveling at 60 mph. The rear differential locks up. The car crashes and burns with everyone trapped inside. Now, should we initiate a recall? Take the number of vehicles in the field, A, multiply by the probable rate of failure, B, multiply by the average out-of-court settlement, C. A times B times C equals X. If X is less than the cost of a recall, we don't do one."

Nintendo simply miscalculated on B. It sucks for business, but it happens all the time.

[Nate the Great]

Urk. Excessive logic. Gak!

[ijdgaf]

I am posting this message from my Wii. Terribly unwieldy. But I guess you get what you pay for. Free is free For the trial version anyway -- full version will be $5, I hear. (shrug).

[Derek]

Actually, I think the full version will be $5 for anyone who gets their Wii AFTER June. If you have it prior to June the full version will be free, just like the trial version.

[ijdgaf]

I just hope the full version stops adding ".us" every time I try to end a sentence with a period.

It's a nice feature to have I guess, but I can't think of many practical uses for it. Except for maybe those flash game sites. Haven't tried 'em yet.

[Nate the Great]

Okay, you guys shifted topics again without a clutch.

[ijdgaf]

So... Any "The Office" fans here?

[mudshark]

Okay, you guys shifted topics again without a clutch.
Moving on...

[Nate the Great]

Returning to Gamecube vs. Revolution, broken Wiimotes aside are there any killer apps yet. And don't say TP, please...

[Zeke]

Ruling out TP makes no sense. By all reports, it's very much a killer app.

[Burt]

Get a Wii. Really...do get one. I honestly can't explain how much fun it is. People I know who never even go near consoles are spending ages playing mine. The free Wii Sport games are amazing. Not much depth, but the Tennis, with 4 people can go on for hours! The bowling is pretty good too. WarioWare is a pretty fantastic game. Zelda is, I hear, amazing as expected, although I haven't had enough time to get more than 30 minutes in to it.
Few big games coming out too.
Really though, it is worth it. I did worry that maybe the whole sensor...wireless...wiimote thing, might not work as well as expected. And no, while it isn't exacty like the real thing, when you hit a backhand on Wii Tennis, and the controller rumbles and it's little speaker makes a sound of a tennis ball smacking off a racket....it makes you smile!

[Nate the Great]

According to Wikipedia:

"A killer application (commonly shortened to killer app) is a computer program that is so useful or desirable that it proves the value of some underlying technology, such as a gaming console, operating system, or piece of computer hardware."

TP is available on Gamecube, so it is NOT a killer app for Revolution. Period.

[Burt]

Whats TP?

[Burt]

Oh right. Zelda. I figured it out now. Lets be kind with the sarcasm.

[Burt]

Getting a Gamecube would make little sense.... As the wii can play gamecube games...
Ok.. say £80 for a Gamecube with 5 games.
£210 for a Wii with 'TP' and wii sports. Yes it's more, and may mean more saving...but you then open up the option of getting games for two different systems. To be honest, cube games have pretty much dried up... there's very few new ones due out.

[ijdgaf]

Very few.

TP is a killer app for the system based on the controls alone. It's quite a bit more fun than playing Zelda the old fashioned way. Plus, it came out on Wii first.

It'd be like saying Halo isn't a killer app for X-Box because it also came out on PC later. That's madness -- Halo is the star of the system, and much better on the console anyway.

For other upcomming killer apps, try Super Paper Mario (due in a little more than a week), Super Smash Brothers Brawl, Super Mario Galaxy, and Metroid Prime 3 Corruption.

Also, most hardcore gamers would scoff at this comment, but Wii Sports really is a killer app as well. Based soley on the way its simplicity has turned non-gamers everywhere into Wiiphiles.

[Nate the Great]

Who needs new Gamecube games? I want OLD Gamecube games. Master Quest, Melee, Pokemon Colloseum, Megaman Anniversary Collection, and so on.

[AKAArzosah]

So get a Gamecube then?

[Nate the Great]

I would, but it's still a sizable investment. That's why I started this thread in the first place, I needed to keep myself occupied considering the options, since I couldn't act anytime soon anyway.

[AKAArzosah]

Ah. It just seemed to me that you'd already made up your mind.

Well, I STILL like playstation best. Not that it matters.

[Nate the Great]

Which Playstation? There are threeish, right?

[AKAArzosah]

I have Playstation 2, which is fine for me because I'm not a super-video-game-freak. But sure, I'd love a PS3, assuming it does everything the Playstation 2 does, and more.

Personally I think Playstation was better first (if that made sense) because they used CD-like discs first, and because the Playstation 2 could still play the Playstation 1 games.
It has Kingdom Hearts, as well. Though I was disappointed with Kingdom Hearts 2's ending.
In a brief, off-topic interlude, has anyone here ever played Alundra 2?

[Derek]

Who needs new Gamecube games? I want OLD Gamecube games. Master Quest, Melee, Pokemon Colloseum, Megaman Anniversary Collection, and so on.

You know, if you get a Wii, you can play new AND old Gamecube games. Not to mention Wii games.

[Zeke]

You know what's the hard part of getting a Wii? <i>Getting a Wii.</i> I finally have the money this month, but everybody's sold out.

I find it very satisfying that they have plenty of PS3s.

[Derek]

Yes, I made friends with the electronics guy at Target and he tipped me off as to when a new shipment was coming in.

And getting Wii Play wasn't the easiest thing ever either.

[Nate the Great]

Of course there are plenty of PS3s. As far as I'm concerned, I don't care if the thing can do my taxes, six hundred is TOO MUCH. For that money I could get a Gamecube, a Revolution, and three games for each. Come on!

But the Revolution can't use a Gameboy Player either, can it? And I don't think that there are any Gameboy games on Virtual Console, either, are there?

[ijdgaf]

Wii cannot hook to a Gameboy player, no. There is talk however of gameboy games on virtual console. Or perhaps a virtual console equivalent on DS. Or, and this is purely speculation on my part, a gameboy player 2.0 that would work on Wii. The system is still new, and I'd be surprised if there weren't some newfangled way to play GB games on your tv before the 8th generation.

Or, as I said earlier, you could get a DS and have access to both the DS and GBA libraries. The DS is really the strongest system out there right now -- handhelds or consoles -- and it's really worth a look at this point if you're even remotely interested in video games, IMO.

[Nate the Great]

If you think my anti-Revolution prejudice is strong, DON'T get me started on DSs not being backward compatable. DON'T. I'll even say it again, DON'T. They could've charged ten bucks more, kept the old Z85 processor to allow for Gameboy backwards compatibility, called it Gameboy DS, and sold umpteen million more copies. I'm not joking. Besides, Nintendo themselves say that DS is the "third pillar" of Nintendo. It's not a Gameboy, it wasn't supposed to be.

Heck, if they had made Gameboy DS, you could work the wireless connection to turn it into a universal Gameboy Player for Revolution. The DS blanks out, and there's your game on the screen.

[ijdgaf]

Nate, forgive me, but you simply expect way too much from Nintendo. At this rate, you will never be satisfied. And of course, the industry left you (and from what I can tell from my general perusings of video game-centric forums, only you) behind long ago.

The DS allows you to play DS games and GBA games. That's twice as many libraries it draws from as the Gamecube. Also, you really shouldn't think of the DS as lacking these older titles -- the fact that they included GBA support at all is simply a matter of convenience. Nintendo decided the system needed some sort of expansion slot for devices (rumble packs, extra memory, whatever). Since one of the system's processor's was already the same as the GBA's, they decided it would be easiest (and a BONUS -- get that? BONUS -- for its customers) if said expansion slot was a GBA slot. So what if it doesn't play older games? It's nice enough that you can play GBA games.

The Wii allows you to play Wii games, GC games, N64 games, SNES games, NES games, Sega Genesis games, and TurboGraphix games. With the possibility of more systems supported after an upgrade of the firmware. Nobody else even remotely approaches that kind of catalog. Is it really such a shame you can't play a few generations worth of portable titles right now?

You really don't have any idea how successful the DS is, do you? It's pretty much the most popular handheld ever. And well on its way toward usurping the most popular console ever, the PS2. Nobody gives a damn about the lack of support for GameBoy or GameBoy Color games -- really, there aren't too many legendary titles from either generation. You can live without 'em -- or make do by buying a GBC used for 10 bucks. Or less.

You're never going to find the perfect system with your attitude. Because there is no perfect system. Because God forbid, the name sucks. Or because it doesn't offer the full libraries of every game system ever. Or because it asks you the tiniest inconvenience of using a damn wrist strap while playing. Or because it has the gall to cost more than two hundred dollars.

There's really no point in me saying any of these things, because you (a) don't seem to be getting the system any time in the remote future, (b) have already made up your mind anyway, and (c) have a severely anachronistic bias against the company's newer entries when virtually every other gaming community I've taken a gander at has grown more fond of them, not less.

Gah.

[Nate the Great]

Apparently I do expect too much, if stuff like "proper beta testing" and "asking the customers what they want" is too much.

"Nice enough?" That's settling. I choose not to settle when that much time and money is involved. That's where quality comes from, people not settling.

Since when does popularity=quality? Never saw that written down as a requirement. Anywhere.

"You're never going to find the perfect system with your attitude. Because there is no perfect system."
But there are better systems and worse systems.
"Because God forbid, the name sucks."
So even you admit it!
"Or because it doesn't offer the full libraries of every game system ever."
Fine. Small defeat conceded.
"Or because it asks you the tiniest inconvenience of using a damn wrist strap while playing."
I refer you to the "it's not a perfect world, and people don't have perfect memories" arguement from earlier.
"Or because it has the gall to cost more than two hundred dollars."
I want what I pay for, and PS3s don't give me that, in my opinion.

[ijdgaf]

The finger Nintendo has placed on the public's pulse is doing some damn impressive tactile perception. Asking the public what they want? Are you sure you don't mean asking you what you want? Wii and DS are both EXTREMELY popular right now. What's to complain about?

In terms of proper beta testing, why don't you do a comparison to Microsoft's X "Our system freezes permanently" Boxes. Or Sony's Play "Whoops, our power cords melt" Stations. Everybody screws up. Everybody fixes their screw-ups. What's to complain about?

Finally, I was referring to the Wii, not the PS3 in terms of "costing more than two hundred dollars". Anybody mad that the final system cost $250 is (1) not paying attention to the competition, and (2) not paying attention to the history of launch prices.

Finally finally, the nobody cares about whether or not the name sucks anymore. And for the record, the name "Revolution" sucks.

[Nate the Great]

Did I express any disapproval about the $250? I have ZERO arguement on that score. It's cheaper than the alternatives and comes with a darn good game. I've played Wii Sports.

"Nobody cares"? I care. I'm not nobody. Say "it's not going to change" and you're absolutely right. Say "you're obsessing about something that on the whole isn't that important" and you're absolutely right. Say "You're a bloody loony, Nate," and you're absolutely right. I deny none of these things. But I'm not nobody, and please don't claim otherwise.

[ijdgaf]

3. They refused to add DVD capability, charge fifty bucks more, and sell umpteen million more systems.

I apologise, but when the percentage of people who care is based on an exceedingly small dividend and an exceedingly large divisor, I round down.

Also, the point I forgot to touch on -- I'm not just talking about popularity here. I'm talking about popularity amongst those already fanatics. Wii and DS have done plenty to extend the market toward people who never really played games before. But they're also hella popular amongst gamers in general and Nintendo fanboys in particular. Now, that might not have any relevance to quality in your book. But by saying that, you effectively make quality a subjective phenomenon, and I'm forced to question whether you're secretly a Battlefield: Earth geek.

[Burt]

Ok it’s probably best if we steer clear of the controversial topics of computer game consoles and stick to something less inflammatory like euthanasia/abortion/Iraqi war.


It was rather funny, walking though the town today. Giant signs in the windows of Woolworths, Game, Gamestation and the like saying 'Yes! We Have PS3'S!'
Not so long ago the signs read 'No! We're out of WII's!'
There really does seem to be a bit of a backlash towards Sony and the PS. Whats is it with that? I mean, I'm not a huge fan, but I do have a old playstation and may get a ps2 - whatever you think of it, it's got a fair few amazing games... I just don't think Sony try as hard as Nintendo. What ever you think of Nintendo...you must admit, they have some talent. The amazing string of popular games they create. Pokemon, Mario, Advanced Wars, StarFox, Metroid... Who else can claim that?
But I don't really wanna see the PS3 outta the market, it's just after seeing the Playstation slap my beloved N64 around for about 4 years straight (and then the poor Gamecube - rest in peace my little buddy), it'll be nice to see sony on the backfoot for a change.

[Nate the Great]

Yeah, dialing it down would be a good idea. Might I suggest returning to my more lighthearted threads about Trek singers and mindless computer games?

[Chancellor Valium]

Ok it’s probably best if we steer clear of the controversial topics of computer game consoles and stick to something less inflammatory like euthanasia/abortion/Iraqi war.


It was rather funny, walking though the town today. Giant signs in the windows of Woolworths, Game, Gamestation and the like saying 'Yes! We Have PS3'S!'
Not so long ago the signs read 'No! We're out of WII's!'
There really does seem to be a bit of a backlash towards Sony and the PS. Whats is it with that? I mean, I'm not a huge fan, but I do have a old playstation and may get a ps2 - whatever you think of it, it's got a fair few amazing games... I just don't think Sony try as hard as Nintendo. What ever you think of Nintendo...you must admit, they have some talent. The amazing string of popular games they create. Pokemon, Mario, Advanced Wars, StarFox, Metroid... Who else can claim that?
But I don't really wanna see the PS3 outta the market, it's just after seeing the Playstation slap my beloved N64 around for about 4 years straight (and then the poor Gamecube - rest in peace my little buddy), it'll be nice to see sony on the backfoot for a change.

Basically?

They stopped pretending they cared, and just admitted that they were effectively out to grub as much of your money as possible.

That, and the price is ridiculous-outrageous...

[Nate the Great]

They want to "grub" our money? :) Does that mean eat it or are we digging in frozen dirt for worms? :)

[PointyHairedJedi]

Very few.
...but Wii Sports really is a killer app as well. Based soley on the way its simplicity has turned non-gamers everywhere into Wiiphiles.
Right there is why I'll never ever own one. Wii Sports? Did they even stop to think about that for a second?

Why I'll probably never own a PS3 is down to mainly backwards compatibility (or the extremely patchy nature thereof), though the fact that we're paying more for it in the UK that most places and Sony's inexplicable decision to change the spec of the consoles sold in the European market are pretty big factors too.

[Nate the Great]

Change the specs? How?

[Chancellor Valium]

More to the point, why is a console wearing glasses?

That should surely indicate shoddy workmanship, if the PS3's eyesight is that bad.

[ijdgaf]

Valium, care to clarify your apparent disdain for Wii Sports? Have you ever even played it? It's not really something you can understand from screen shots or commercials. You really have to play it to get it.

[Derek]

Wii Sports is awesome. I had my brother and his girlfriend over a couple weeks ago and they played it and are thinking about getting the console for themselves because of it. I had my parents over the other night and they played it and loved it. I had another group of people over and showed off Wii Sports, and they thought it was great (and some of these people are grandmother-age). It is awesome. You swing the remote like a tennis racket. What could be easier?

[Nate the Great]

Why is a console wearing specs? Because a trapper has more lint than what's good for it.

(In case you're lost, it's an extremely old and lame joke based on Static Shock. Feel free to consider me three fries short of a Happy Meal now)

[Hejira]

I packed up my Wii to take to my father's unit a little under a month ago to see if he'd play. He didn't, but that was okay.

I haven't unpacked it since.

My Wii needs a killer app more than I do. Don't get me wrong, I love it. I just don't have anything fun I can do with it. Playing Wii Boxing with my feet could only keep me amused for a certain period of time.

[Chancellor Valium]

I never even mentioned Urination Games. I have nothing against it other than the name, and I have no idea what it is.

[mudshark]

Sounds like something that should work with TiSP.

[Zeke]

What about TP, Hejira?

I never even mentioned Urination Games. I have nothing against it other than the name, and I have no idea what it is.

I believe IJD meant to say "PHJ," not "Valium."

[ijdgaf]

Wow. No idea how I made that mistake, either. Coulda sworn it was Valium who said that.

[Chancellor Valium]

O_o

And that's all I have to say on this.

Late-night posting?

[Zeke]

The important thing is, BRAAAAAAAIIIINS!

[Hejira]

What about TP, Hejira?*clears throat*

*prepares for fanboy onslaught*

*clears throat again*

Meh.

Yes, I meh'd TP, and it meh'd back. Two damn hours it took me to catch a damn fish for that damn cat. Why should Link have to suck at fishing because I do?

[ijdgaf]

Fishing is easy in the game. The explanation the game gives you on how to fish is... well, it's shit.

Don't give up on the game because of that though. The game has a bit of a slow start and takes a while to get going, but once it does it's great.

Here's a brief explanation on how to fish, just because:

1) drop line into water. Try to keep the bobber near the surface.

2) as soon as the bobber starts to sink, yank up.

3) if this doesn't work the first time, just keep trying. It shouldn't take too many tries using this method.

4) After the fish bites, you don't have to hit anything. Link automatically pulls it in.

I know this the hard way. At one point in the game I spent four damn hours trying everything and no fish were buying. The reason? Because nobody ever explained how absurdly easy it was to fish in the game. I was making it too damn hard. Finally I was so frustrated I registered on the Penny Arcade forums just to ask how to fish. Once it was explained, took me a minute or two to get things right.

I have no idea why Nintendo dropped the ball on that tutorial -- normally, that sort of thing is extremely polished, and indeed the rest of the game is sparkling in this regard. But seriously, don't give up on TP because of one minor glitch. The instructions above will yield you a fish in five minutes or less. And the rest of the game is top-notch. Don't give up.

[mudshark]

*clears throat*

*prepares for fanboy onslaught*

*clears throat again*

Meh.
*applauds*

[Nate the Great]

For the record, fishing in OOT stinks too. So is horseback archery. The only things that I need to do to get 100% on that game involve horseback archery. I hate it. A lot. Repeat "I hate it. A lot." about a hundred more times while you're at it.

May I ask why you need to get a fish for a cat? I thought that Zelda was supposed to be beyond the usual fetch quests. Sure, OOT has a few, but those are for optional upgrades. It's not required.

[ijdgaf]

It's not really an in-depth fetch quest or anything. I honestly don't remember all the details at this point, that was so early in the game. I think you're helping to rescue a lady's cat that has run off so that she'll give you... something... don't remember what.

Not so different from the "catch five of my cukoos" thing from OoT, or the "my nose is very sensitive to powders" thing in LA.

[Nate the Great]

"My nose is very sensitive to powders?" Who talks like that? "Powders irritate my nose" is better.

[ijdgaf]

You see how well you talk when you're transformed into a mystical racoon.

[Nate the Great]

I'll be sure to keep that in mind.

[Chancellor Valium]

"My nose is very sensitive to powders?" Who talks like that? "Powders irritate my nose" is better.

Umm...Japanese translation gremlins?

You can't exactly blame them, though. Somebody set them up the bomb/they have no chance to survive make their time...

[Nate the Great]

You haven't experienced AYB until you've seen a million duplicated Robot Masters say it at the same time. Another reason why I love Bob and George.

[PointyHairedJedi]

Wow. No idea how I made that mistake, either. Coulda sworn it was Valium who said that.
Now you've scared me. :eek:

(That's not so much a 'surprised' smiley as a 'cold rectal thermometer' smiley, really.)

[Nate the Great]

And do you speak from experience? ;)

[Hejira]

Sorry, but every blue smilie has just turned into, 'cold rectal thermometer' in my head. WHY ARE YOU SMILING AND WINKING?

[Nate the Great]

The winking smilie was just to convey the age-old "nudge nudge, wink wink" kind of body language.

[ijdgaf]

"Because God forbid, the name sucks."
So even you admit it!

For some dumb, perhaps suicidal reason, I feel like returning to this point. I've been thinking about it a little bit.

Let's examine a few system names. Game Boy. PlayStation. X-Box. Saying "I'm playing my Game Boy" out loud today, had the system never come out in the first place, would have unusual and likely disturbing conotations. Were it "Game Man", things would be even worse (hint: say it out loud). PlayStation just sounds dorky. X-Box sounds like it's trying too hard to be "X-TREME 2 DA MAX!!1", which in fairness, the name really was.

Really, all video game systems have had pretty lame names. And for the most part, gamers haven't really noticed or cared. "Wii" sounds a bit different, sure. But is it really any worse than "Game Boy"?

Furthermore, I realize even you admit it's a silly bone of contention. But you still seem to have this eerie, somewhat forced bias against both of Nintendo's systems, with price being the only bit of logic I think has any bearing. Are the systems not 100% backward compatable? Yeah. Do they play movies? No. Has Nintendo made a few missteps in the direction of each? Definitely. Their insistance on using friend codes as the basis for their online system is absolutely silly.

But really, if you look around at the opinions of Nintendo fans, and if you'll examine the marketshare each is gaining monthly, you'll find that most of these people don't find these issues such a big stumbling block toward buying the system. I've seen more than one forumgoer on more than one forum call the software line-up on the DS the greatest, most diverse one Nintendo has had since the days of the SNES.

The fact of the matter is, Nintendo is in the midst of a second rennaisance of sorts. There are some really, really stellar titles on the DS. And the Wii is just getting started, but by the end of the year it'll have a similarly ice-solid library -- I guaruntee. It's been a long time since the gamer community was this excited about Nintendo. In terms of sheer word of mouth, they're the company to beat right now.

So basically what you should be asking yourself, if I may, is this: would a future iteration of you feel any regret about missing out on such a creative boon the likes of which your favorite video game publisher hasn't seen in a good decade or longer? Is this something you won't feel bad about missing out on by then? Sure, you can always buy either system later, after the price drops dramatically and the next generation kicks off. But by then, the industry will have moved on and you'll be playing yesterday's greats. And you won't really be partaking in this new wave of Nintendo excitement. You'll just be getting the hand-me-downs.

I love my retro gaming, don't get me wrong. My entertainment center in my room has an SNES, N64, and Wii hooked up to one TV, with a shelf holding every iteration of the Game Boy. I still play plenty of old games. But there's something... special (hokey, yes) about going to an electronics store on the launch date of a major release and enjoying a brand-new experience while it's still refreshing and state-of-the-art.

Obviously the decision is yours. But by buying a last-gen system, you miss out on the current generation. The reverse is not the case.

[mudshark]

^ But that would be arguing from a rational and systematically-arrived-at position.

Wouldn't it?



Now you've scared me. :eek:

(That's not so much a 'surprised' smiley as a 'cold rectal thermometer' smiley, really.)

Sorry, but every blue smilie has just turned into, 'cold rectal thermometer' in my head. WHY ARE YOU SMILING AND WINKING?
http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g223/mudshark58/smilies/bgbiggrin.gif

[Nate the Great]

If you're going to start into "all game system names are lame," then I'm going to start "is Revolution really any lamer?"

"Wii" is WORSE than Game Boy. Putting aside inevitable comparisons to urine, it's still a childish exclamation of joy, emphasis on "childish."

Oh, and while we're on the subject: are they selling any fewer Playstations or X-Boxes because they have to translate the name for foreign markets? Seriously.

[ijdgaf]

X-Box 360 and PlayStation 3 are, in Japan, called "X-Box 360" and "PlayStation 3" respectively.

Obviously, whether a name is retarded or not is a subjective opinion. Do I believe the name is silly? Yes. Is it the silliest name out there? Definitely not. I really do think "Game Boy" takes the cake on that one. And it's about as bad as "X-Box" (LOLZ SEXXBOXX LOLZ). But -- again, obviously -- milliage will vary.

But forget that argument for a second, if you are indeed capable of doing so. How does the name have any bearing whatsoever on the quality of the system itself? Sure, if there was some vast upset over the ridiculous name, profits would be down, budgets would be cut, and sure -- quality would suffer. But that's not at all the case. I sincerely doubt most Wii owners even know what "Nintendo Revolution" refers to. And those who do have long since moved on to other, more important issues like "Is the system fun to play?" and "How is the quality of the game library?". You can debate the answers to these questions, and many have. But really, the only discussion I see anymore about "Wii" vs "Revolution" is right here in this forum. Everyone else has moved on. And a vast majority of Nintendo Zealots along with a good proportion of the rest of the gaming community is really excited about Nintendo's new direction.

[ijdgaf]

^ But that would be arguing from a rational and systematically-arrived-at position.

When all else fails...

[Nate the Great]

Apparently my admission of total stupidity of opinion yet total, one hundred percent refusal to change my mind is falling on deaf ears.

Game Boy takes the cake on silliest? I think I ran a poll on that awhile back.

http://www.fiveminute.net/forums/showthread.php?t=1139

And the Wii won, by a factor of three, so I don't think there's anything more to say.

[AKAArzosah]

Is anyone else finding it fun just to sit here and watch this thread? Because I sure am.

[ijdgaf]

Two things,

First, as long as we're apparentlying... apparently, the whole concept of "milliage will vary" and "suckiness of a console's name is subjective" is falling on deaf ears. Run all the totally unbiased, one hundred percent scientific polls about console names on humor website forums all you want. Apparently (again with the apparentlies) you don't understand that the statement "I really do think "Game Boy" takes the cake on that one" is a statement of opinion. Your enormously accurate citation does nothing to alter my "opinion".

Second, you started this thread asking for opinions. Apologies for offering them and the offenses that resulted from my efforts to help you come to a so-called decision.

And because it probably needs to be said, a third thing. I realize by prefacing the following with the phrase "this is not a threat" will only plant the notion "is he threatening me?" in the reader's head. But I reiterate -- this is not a threat.

Ahem.

As others have observed, this has become somewhat heated for what should be a relatively straightforward discussion about something that has far less importance in our world than big-picture issues like religion and politics. We don't talk about the latter here precisely because we wish to avoid said heat. Now I realize I am a participant in this discussion, but I also have moderator powers here. Now, I'm not pointing fingers in particular because certainly I have contributed to the heated nature of this discussion. This is precisely why I'm making a point to say this; it would be pretty damn irresponsible of me to let it escalate and escalate (if indeed it would) until Zeke gets irked enough to close it. I'm posting in here, and I need to keep an eye on things.

Can we try to keep this thread in the manner of "Here is a rational argument for this", "Here is my rational objection". Instead of "WHY WON'T YOU LISTEN" times ∞.

In other words, let's leave the indignation and personal bruhahabuh out of it. This is a thread asking for opinions about videogames. Not a holy war.

And if indeed, you are all opinioned out Nate and think the thread has run its course, or if you've already made a decision and don't really want to discuss it anymore, it can be closed.

Thanks for reading, and uh... carry on?

[Nate the Great]

As I recall, the original request was: should I

A. Save myself some money by buying a used Gamecube, particularly because there aren't any "must have" Revolution games yet. Besides, it suddenly occurs to me that the next system will inevitably preserve backwards compatibility. Like it or not, the current size disc is here to stay, so it's just a matter of which lasers or whatnot.
B. Splurge on an expensive system where I'll have to get practically everything new, where I'll risk property destruction, where batteries are going to be a major concern, and so forth.

It's you guys who keep trying to change the unchangable.

[ijdgaf]

Then why do you need to solicit opinions when it seems you've overwhelmingly made a decision and are not open to alternative suggestions?

[AKAArzosah]

I asked that earlier, actually. Why doesn't he just get a Gamecube?

I would, but it's still a sizable investment. That's why I started this thread in the first place, I needed to keep myself occupied considering the options, since I couldn't act anytime soon anyway.

So, very brief summary:
Gamecube has the advantage of being cheaper, and the ongoing bonus of cheaper games.
Wii has the advantage of better graphics or whatever, and the ongoing advantage of new games.

The major problem is money, I believe. That was part of Nate's original post. I think what he wants is either an overwhelming argument for Wii, or support for the Gamecube idea. Because he can't afford it if it's not really REALLY worth it.

Nate, why don't you try it before you make up your mind? You must know someone that has one and will be willing to let you try it out. Didn't someone say you can play Gamecube Games on the Wii? You sort of win both ways don't you, by being able to play new games as they come out, and still buy the cheaper old ones you know and love?

[Nate the Great]

Sorry, this thread is closed. I'm just poking sticks at hornet's nests here, you guys keep getting me riled up, and on and on...

I won't even have the three hundred I'd need to set myself up on a used Gamecube, so I suppose it was a moot point to begin with.

[ijdgaf]

I'll close the thread now then, as it seems that's what you want. If I'm vastly misunderstanding you, or you have a change of heart, I can be PMed.

Next time you start a discussion of video game consoles, think about how we can gear the conversation toward "debate, discourse, and light-hearted banter". Not "mutual pig-headedness". I'll try to do the same.

[Zeke]

I just want to add something here: despite their modesty, I think all parties did an excellent job of keeping the argument civilized. This was no flamewar even by our standards, let alone those of the net at large. I'll respect their decision to close the thread, though.