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Old 06-05-2024, 09:39 AM
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Default 5MDV: Proper subsite launch and new fiver

With Discovery ending, the time has finally come for a full reckoning here -- and not just about that show. Here's the story of the last seven years and why (well, some of why) the front page has been so neglected and had some links going nowhere. There's a happy ending, kinda!

Five-Minute Discovery (et al.)

And just so it doesn't get crushed under that wall of text, here's today's new fiver:

Five-Minute "The Butcher's Knife Cares Not For the Lamb's Cry"
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[03:17] FiveMinZeke: Galactica clearly needs the advanced technology of scissors, which get around the whole "yanking on your follicles" problem.
[03:17] IJD: cylons can hack any blades working in conjunction

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Old 06-05-2024, 01:14 PM
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Nate the Great Nate the Great is offline
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I was just thinking the other day that Discovery had three strikes against it right from the start: Spock having an adopted sister, that dumb spore drive, and the complete disrespect for what Klingons are supposed to look like. And when a show has three strikes against it before it even airs, why am I supposed to care about it?


It infuriates me how many shows these days seem to think that they can abandon the formula to get a new wider (and more profitable) audience that will render the old audience irrelevant. It has never and will never work. Look at King's Quest Mask of Eternity, or the Star Wars sequel trilogy, or the Willow show.



As a meaningless aside, I was pondering where Enterprise went right and wrong, and the following simple solution occurred to me: have the Tellarites be the obstructing self-righteous aliens. We know next to nothing about them besides the fact that they have quick tempers and are very insecure. Suppose it was the Tellarites that suppressed humanity because unlike the Vulcans they could see humanity's potential. Now both races could evolve along with the Andorians into accepting humanity as an equal and necessary player in galactic politics. Now there would be a Tellarite in the cast along with T'Pol and there would be much more intrigue and potential conflict. Archer could prove himself to both in different ways. Fans of the prior shows could see Kirk, Picard, Sisko, and Janeway in Archer at different times in different situations.
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Old 06-07-2024, 03:47 PM
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Quote:
Q: Who is context for?
Quote:
Q: Who is context for?
Quote:
Q: Who is context for?
Quote:
Q: Who is context for?
Quote:
Q: Who is context for?
Quote:
Q: Who is context for?
Quote:
Q: Who is context for?
Hm!
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Old 06-07-2024, 04:53 PM
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Man, I vibe so hard with this:

Quote:
Saru: So, uh... hi. This is awkward.
Burnham: I'm truly sorry for what I did, Saru. By the way, what do you remember me doing?
Saru: Every possible bad thing except starting the war.
Burnham: THANK you! I was starting to think I was the crazy one!
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Old 06-08-2024, 10:01 AM
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Huh. I wasn't expecting that bit in the FAQ to just break your brain outright. I'm making a note here: "Huge success."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nate the Great View Post
It infuriates me how many shows these days seem to think that they can abandon the formula to get a new wider (and more profitable) audience that will render the old audience irrelevant. It has never and will never work. Look at King's Quest Mask of Eternity, or the Star Wars sequel trilogy, or the Willow show.
In fairness, sometimes it works. The Mandalorian was a very different approach to Star Wars -- and it's easy to forget this now, but so was Deep Space Nine to Trek. These became fan-favourite series because they cared about both being good entertainment and inhabiting/expanding the larger mythology. The problem with so many recent projects is that not only are they ignoring the second thing, they're not even good at the first.

Your Tellarite idea is interesting, but I'm not sure it could've been used to get the Vulcans off the hook. Remember, Archer was never really being fair with the "holding us back" accusation. The Vulcans weren't holding us back, they were just letting us get there ourselves. (They probably had some incident in their past, like the Watchers or the Andalites, that taught them that lesson.) First Contact had already established the Vulcans' technological lead, so if Archer was going to have this "holding us back" grudge, it had to include them.

It might indeed have been interesting if he had this grudge against all the advanced species, and the needless bitchiness we saw from some Vulcans could certainly have been transferred to the Tellarites. But really, I think -- and I'm just realizing this now as I type it -- that the whole idea was misguided. Archer's grudge was understandable after what happened to his dad, but he should've grown out of it. We as a species should want to get there ourselves. And we should understand why we're not getting handouts -- there's more than enough proof in our own history of how badly that can go wrong.
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[03:17] FiveMinZeke: Galactica clearly needs the advanced technology of scissors, which get around the whole "yanking on your follicles" problem.
[03:17] IJD: cylons can hack any blades working in conjunction
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Old 06-08-2024, 12:50 PM
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That's the point. Enterprise Vulcans were never REAL Vulcans. They kept protesting that they were emotionless while showing emotions. And somehow that was supposed to endear them to us.



You really think the Vulcans weren't holding Archer back? We seem to be remembering different shows. They held back the entire concept of the Warp 5 ship and the notion of humanity escaping the kiddie pool of Earth's sector. They felt that humanity wasn't ready to initiate first contact with anyone, the Vulcans would introduce new species to them on their timetable.


The point is that if the Tellarites see Earth's potential as a threat (in particular humanity's ideas of how commerce and wealth distribution should work), they could be the ones holding Earth back while the Vulcans act like REAL Vulcans, offering advice and a helping hand while not interfering.


Let's come back to the IDIC. Having diversity is a GOOD thing. Never forget Surak in "The Savage Curtain". "I am pleased to see that we have differences. May we together become greater than the sum of both of us." Enterprise Vulcans acted like there was some Bible equivalent that guided their lives and no new ideas could enter it. A stagnant culture, in other words.


When did Archer want handouts? He just wanted humanity to have the freedom to make its own mistakes and have their own victories.
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Adam Savage: I reject your reality and substitute my own!

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Crow T. Robot: Oh, stop pretending there's a plot. Don't cheapen yourself further.

Last edited by Nate the Great; 06-10-2024 at 10:07 PM.
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Old 06-10-2024, 04:08 AM
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I was going from memory there, but it turns out my memory was a bit flawed -- there's some dialogue evidence of the Vulcans throwing their weight around to slow down even Earth's independent progress. That said, there's also evidence that Archer and others blame them for not outright sharing their advancements. (First episode, Archer to T'Pol: "Your scientists held back just enough information to keep [my father] from succeeding.") So it's neither a clean "they held Earth back" or a clean "they just didn't share", and a quick google shows fans debating it many times.

To bring this full circle, while I've generally defended ENT's asshole Vulcans (I think 100 years is more than long enough for a society to change), I've never understood the critics so well as I do now, with Strange New Worlds currently wreaking utter devastation on TOS's Vulcan characters (among others).

Btw, did anyone catch the very old 5MV callback in the fiver?
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[03:17] FiveMinZeke: Galactica clearly needs the advanced technology of scissors, which get around the whole "yanking on your follicles" problem.
[03:17] IJD: cylons can hack any blades working in conjunction
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Old 06-11-2024, 02:48 PM
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Woo, new stuff coming!

Quote:
For me, there are only various people's high-budget fanfics now;
That's how I feel about the SW sequel trilogy movies, and how I'm able to enjoy them for what they are.

That's a very nice-looking subsite logo.

Quote:
Landry: WAH! No fair!
Lorca: *stares*
Landry: I thought it might be fun to try having a personality.
Lorca: Stop.
Pffft.

As for callbacks, I see
Quote:
You're asking for, like, the biggest one ever!
And, of course, Klingons on hats.
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Last edited by NAHTMMM; 06-11-2024 at 02:49 PM. Reason: clarity
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Old 06-11-2024, 09:46 PM
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Actually, your first quote was the callback! I ganked two lines straight from Five-Minute Star Trek II because it was such a Kobayashi Maru-like scene. I'm still in touch with FatMat on FB, and needless to say, this made his day.

OTOH, you may have stumped me with one of those. Klingons on hats was a thing? (ED: Oh yeah, the Tribble episodes!)
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FiveMinute.net: because stuff is long and life is short

[03:17] FiveMinZeke: Galactica clearly needs the advanced technology of scissors, which get around the whole "yanking on your follicles" problem.
[03:17] IJD: cylons can hack any blades working in conjunction

Last edited by Zeke; 06-11-2024 at 11:28 PM.
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Old 06-25-2024, 05:36 PM
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I haven't watched either S5 of Discovery or S3 of Picard — just haven't gotten around to them. We've enjoyed all the current series (SNW, LD, Prodigy) for what they are. I'm not too uptight about canon any more. I watch what I like, and ignore what I don't like.

Marvel made an absolute hash of timelines and character from about Phase 3 onward. Doctor Who openly considers canon to be something you wave at as you fly by. Sherlock's writers went so far off the deep end that they ended up in the multiverse. Star Wars is so diluted and spread out that "canon" no longer has meaning. Hell, even The X-Files went off the rails early on because Chris Carter planned for 5 seasons but at the end of S3 Fox begged him to extend it, so he had to jettison his five-year plan and the whole show just got weird and exhausting after Duchovny and then Anderson left. This isn't a new thing.

Zeke, I totally hear you about mentally de-canonizing certain series because they no longer follow Gene's vision. Focus on what makes you happy. I'll be here, whatever you write.
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