Christmas Who

[Zeke]

Hmm. Valium, I'm not sure what you're implying about RTD's comment. Who would he be taking a cheap shot at? It sounds to me like he was just giving a goofy answer to a goofy question.

[Chancellor Valium]

Originally Posted by Zeke

Hmm. Valium, I'm not sure what you're implying about RTD's comment. Who would he be taking a cheap shot at? It sounds to me like he was just giving a goofy answer to a goofy question.

You mean aside from everyone who died at the hands of a mass-murderer and Russell T. Davies' own audience?

Here's the article, for those who're interested.

http://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/nort...5578-20282885/

Somehow, criticism of RNT never leaks out beyond the local level.

[Zeke]

Wait, are we talking about "Voyage of the Damned" or "Time Crash" in this thread? The latter is this year's Children in Need special -- a few minutes of pure fun, available on YouTube. Check it out.

As for RTD's joke, there's a pattern I've noticed about jokes and other public statements: the more serious and "risky" the material, the more its success depends on how you feel about the speaker and not whether the joke is any good. We'll put up with Hitler jokes from people we like -- you have in the past, for instance. I think it's because we assume our friends, being good people, are fully conscious of how bad Hitler was. Our enemies we're not so sure about.

Take South Park for another example. My dad has watched very little of it, and like many Catholics, he was disgusted with what he read about the recent episode "Bloody Mary". I'm Catholic too, but I defend the show and even that episode. Why? Not because I think the jokes at our expense were good -- they were gross and offensive. But Matt and Trey have given me too many laughs, and I've seen them go after too many worthy targets that no other show dares to touch. (In fact, the Catholic stuff in "Bloody Mary" was a smokescreen for that episode's real target -- Alcoholics Anonymous, a sacred cow if ever there was one.)

I'm not saying, Valium, that you're blinded by your dislike of RTD. But I do think that intensified your reaction. I have no great love for the man either, but I don't think it's fair to take his comment as more than a dumb joke answer to, let's face it, a pretty silly question. Also, even a real insult to the Doctor isn't automatically an insult to his fans.

Somehow, criticism of RNT never leaks out beyond the local level.

Somehow I find that hard to believe. We have too many counterexamples around here.

[danieldoof]

Originally Posted by Zeke

Wait, are we talking about "Voyage of the Damned" or "Time Crash" in this thread? The latter is this year's Children in Need special -- a few minutes of pure fun, available on YouTube. Check it out.

Cool thanks for mentioning that bit

I havent seen the complete version yet....I have only seen the ending of this little special so far...the collision.

[PointyHairedJedi]

Originally Posted by Zeke

Somehow I find that hard to believe. We have too many counterexamples around here.

There is some validity in that - the BBC is plenty happy to do empty puff pieces masquerading as "news" on viewing figures, new companions, and such, but I don't believe I've heard even a hint when it comes to dissatisfied fans, the very ones that made Who seem a viable prospect again by buying the novels and audios for a decade and a half.

[Zeke]

Fair enough, but I very much doubt the naysayers comprise anything like a majority of those fans. It's the same situation we had for so long with VOY and ENT. The B&B-haters were never the Trekkie consensus they loudly claimed to be.

[Chancellor Valium]

Z: Never read those before, not amused.

[whoiam]

I'd have suggested Hitler for an incarnation of the Master.

As for Voyage of the damned? Take Tennant's first season... skew the Doctor's characterisation a little... and replace Ms. Piper with a short wooden effigy of her (or slightly wooden, to be fair, but either way, Ms. Minogue seems rather out of practice when it comes to acting).

Shame about the villains (At least they weren't the robotic santas again) although Max wasn't too bad, the Host really were just another Cybermen/Daleks -esqe army of identical mindless killers... the poor reprogramming job makes Max look bloody incompetent.

And the endings for Astrid ("Now you can float forever", or whatever he actually said) - where she was, in effect, doomed to eternity floating in the stars, without an entirely functioning consciousness, and quite clearly too delusional to realise what she was passing through - and the tour guide (whose name escapes me). Not that I minded the tour guide's fate, but rather the stupid "I travel alone" bit the Doctor did, despite the fact he quite evidently does *not*. Maybe it's a case of "I travel alone unless there's a decent chance of me generating sexual tension", which isn't far off the mark - only 2 characters have gotten into the Tardis more then once in RTD's reign without having fallen in love with, or kissed, the Doctor. Mickey and Adam.

If memory serves, he's only had one serial in which he didn't have a companion, and that was back in Tom Baker's time.

...if anyone needs me, I'll be in the angry dome...

[Zeke]

Originally Posted by Chancellor Valium

Z: Never read those before, not amused.

Fine. I was using "you" collectively anyway. (That's why I said your name later to clarify that I meant you.) And I think that was kind of a rude way to answer a longish post where I made an actual case, but whatever.